Comments on: Bible-Based Morality? The Fourth Commandment http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/ Atheism & Religious Skepticism Thu, 02 Sep 2010 01:11:28 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5898 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 18:01:05 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5898 You are correct in your observation that the first four Commandments differ from the rest. The first four are about our relationship with God, the last six deal with how to treat our fellow man. You have also correctly identified the true day of worship. Well done, as you said, a vast majority of Christians can’t even get that one right. It is important to note, however, that it was Rome and the Catholic Church that changed the day, not Paul or by any other word from the Bible. The Catholic Church believes it has the power to do, basically, whatever it pleases. This means they believe they have the right to change the word and laws of God Himself. That is a very big problem for those who believe the Bible, but many ignore the facts that have been changed, I suppose because they believe the Catholic Church truly does have the right to do so. You are correct in your observation that the first four Commandments differ from the rest. The first four are about our relationship with God, the last six deal with how to treat our fellow man. You have also correctly identified the true day of worship. Well done, as you said, a vast majority of Christians can’t even get that one right. It is important to note, however, that it was Rome and the Catholic Church that changed the day, not Paul or by any other word from the Bible.

The Catholic Church believes it has the power to do, basically, whatever it pleases. This means they believe they have the right to change the word and laws of God Himself. That is a very big problem for those who believe the Bible, but many ignore the facts that have been changed, I suppose because they believe the Catholic Church truly does have the right to do so.

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5896 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:51:30 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5896 Again I agree with you on this point; for some Christians to claim the Ten Commandments and yet ignore this one is clear and blatant hypocrisy. How can those who believe in Christ reject the law spoken by God's own voice? How can any that follow God ignore His law? How strange it is that the Commandment most often forgotten is the only one that begins with the word “remember.” We cannot pick and choose which Commandments to follow, all are good and none have changed. This is a matter of worship; Satan has convinced many that God does not exist, but for those who still believe, he must confuse them. What better way than to corrupt their laws and their worship? It is an ugly and evil form of compromise; they still get to worship and believe in God, but Satan has influenced so much change and corruption that they are not truly following the word of God. God is unchanging, so why would his law change? It did not, it does not, it will not. Again I agree with you on this point; for some Christians to claim the Ten Commandments and yet ignore this one is clear and blatant hypocrisy. How can those who believe in Christ reject the law spoken by God's own voice? How can any that follow God ignore His law? How strange it is that the Commandment most often forgotten is the only one that begins with the word “remember.”

We cannot pick and choose which Commandments to follow, all are good and none have changed. This is a matter of worship; Satan has convinced many that God does not exist, but for those who still believe, he must confuse them. What better way than to corrupt their laws and their worship? It is an ugly and evil form of compromise; they still get to worship and believe in God, but Satan has influenced so much change and corruption that they are not truly following the word of God. God is unchanging, so why would his law change? It did not, it does not, it will not.

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5897 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:51:12 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5897 The fact that Jesus said, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath,” (Mark 2:27) shows that the Sabbath is a law “for” us, not a burden “to” us. The Commandment reads, “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.” (Exodus 20:8); “to keep it holy” and in other versions “by keeping it holy.” You see, the responsibility of this Commandment rests with us; we keep the Sabbath holy by remembering it. If we do not observe the Sabbath it will lose its value to us. And how important is this Commandment? After Jesus died they did not even finish preparing His body, the body of their savior! They stopped in the middle of His burial, observed the Sabbath, and did not return until Sunday morning (Luke 23:56). Also, despite the importance of the work, the Israelites did not do any of the building of the Holy sanctuary on the Sabbath. And part of God's final message to mankind is a call to worship the Creator (Revelation 14:6,7). The Sabbath is a memorial of God as our maker. It is a witness to His existence, and a reminder of His greatness, wisdom, and love. It started in Eden and, being as old as the world itself, continued to be observed by all the patriarchs from creation to Egypt. During their bondage in Egypt the Israelites were forced to violate the Sabbath and, over the next few hundred years, almost completely lost the knowledge of its sacredness. That is why the first words of the Fourth Commandment are “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy;” it was not a new law they were given, but a law from our very beginning that had become almost completely devalued and forgotten. The fact that Jesus said, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath,” (Mark 2:27Open Link in New Window) shows that the Sabbath is a law “for” us, not a burden “to” us. The Commandment reads, “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.” (Exodus 20:8Open Link in New Window); “to keep it holy” and in other versions “by keeping it holy.” You see, the responsibility of this Commandment rests with us; we keep the Sabbath holy by remembering it. If we do not observe the Sabbath it will lose its value to us. And how important is this Commandment? After Jesus died they did not even finish preparing His body, the body of their savior! They stopped in the middle of His burial, observed the Sabbath, and did not return until Sunday morning (Luke 23:56Open Link in New Window). Also, despite the importance of the work, the Israelites did not do any of the building of the Holy sanctuary on the Sabbath. And part of God's final message to mankind is a call to worship the Creator (Revelation 14:6,7Open Link in New Window).

The Sabbath is a memorial of God as our maker. It is a witness to His existence, and a reminder of His greatness, wisdom, and love. It started in Eden and, being as old as the world itself, continued to be observed by all the patriarchs from creation to Egypt. During their bondage in Egypt the Israelites were forced to violate the Sabbath and, over the next few hundred years, almost completely lost the knowledge of its sacredness. That is why the first words of the Fourth Commandment are “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy;” it was not a new law they were given, but a law from our very beginning that had become almost completely devalued and forgotten.

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5894 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:50:30 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5894 The fact that Jesus said, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath,” (Mark 2:27) shows that the Sabbath is a law “for” us, not a burden “to” us. The Commandment reads, “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.” (Exodus 20:8); “to keep it holy” and in other versions “by keeping it holy.” You see, the responsibility of this Commandment rests with us; we keep the Sabbath holy by remembering it. If we do not observe the Sabbath it will lose its value to us. And how important is this Commandment? After Jesus died they did not even finish preparing His body, the body of their savior! They stopped in the middle of His burial, observed the Sabbath, and did not return until Sunday morning (Luke 23:56). Also, despite the importance of the work, the Israelites did not do any of the building of the Holy sanctuary on the Sabbath. And part of God's final message to mankind is a call to worship the Creator (Revelation 14:6,7). The fact that Jesus said, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath,” (Mark 2:27Open Link in New Window) shows that the Sabbath is a law “for” us, not a burden “to” us. The Commandment reads, “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.” (Exodus 20:8Open Link in New Window); “to keep it holy” and in other versions “by keeping it holy.” You see, the responsibility of this Commandment rests with us; we keep the Sabbath holy by remembering it. If we do not observe the Sabbath it will lose its value to us. And how important is this Commandment? After Jesus died they did not even finish preparing His body, the body of their savior! They stopped in the middle of His burial, observed the Sabbath, and did not return until Sunday morning (Luke 23:56Open Link in New Window). Also, despite the importance of the work, the Israelites did not do any of the building of the Holy sanctuary on the Sabbath. And part of God's final message to mankind is a call to worship the Creator (Revelation 14:6,7Open Link in New Window).

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5895 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:49:57 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5895 When the Pharisees accused Jesus and the disciples of breaking the Fourth Commandment, Jesus used the example of David to show how ridiculous their accusations were. If you read the gospels you will find this a lot; Jesus did not simply say things were right and wrong because He said so, he pointed to scriptures and stories from the past as examples and evidences for proof. The Pharisees were trying to make Sabbath law more important than Sabbath rest, but Jesus (and David in the example Jesus gave) understood that the intent of God's law is to promote love for God and others. Like many today, the Pharisees did not understand this purpose and intent; as a result, many inappropriate judgments are made. To understand what Jesus meant by his reference to David we must know the story he was referring to. Every Sabbath 12 loaves of consecrated bread were set before God in the tabernacle, when the new loaves were brought in the old bread was only to be eaten by the priests on duty. On their journey, David and his men needed food. The priests on duty allowed them to eat the bread because they understood that God's greater law, love – to do good and save lives (Matthew 12:1-13 and Luke 6:1-10) – trumps religious ceremony. So, while no worldly business should interfere with the Sabbath, human needs are well within the boundaries of Sabbath conduct. Caring for the sick and suffering is a “work of mercy” and in no way violates the Sabbath. Remember, Jesus not only taught in the synagogue on Saturday, but performed many miracles on the Sabbath as well. When the Pharisees accused Jesus and the disciples of breaking the Fourth Commandment, Jesus used the example of David to show how ridiculous their accusations were. If you read the gospels you will find this a lot; Jesus did not simply say things were right and wrong because He said so, he pointed to scriptures and stories from the past as examples and evidences for proof. The Pharisees were trying to make Sabbath law more important than Sabbath rest, but Jesus (and David in the example Jesus gave) understood that the intent of God's law is to promote love for God and others. Like many today, the Pharisees did not understand this purpose and intent; as a result, many inappropriate judgments are made.

To understand what Jesus meant by his reference to David we must know the story he was referring to. Every Sabbath 12 loaves of consecrated bread were set before God in the tabernacle, when the new loaves were brought in the old bread was only to be eaten by the priests on duty. On their journey, David and his men needed food. The priests on duty allowed them to eat the bread because they understood that God's greater law, love – to do good and save lives (Matthew 12:1-13Open Link in New Window and Luke 6:1-10Open Link in New Window) – trumps religious ceremony. So, while no worldly business should interfere with the Sabbath, human needs are well within the boundaries of Sabbath conduct. Caring for the sick and suffering is a “work of mercy” and in no way violates the Sabbath. Remember, Jesus not only taught in the synagogue on Saturday, but performed many miracles on the Sabbath as well.

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5893 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:49:29 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5893 By trying to focus too hard on the words of the rule the Pharisees missed its intent. Many of them were so caught up in their man-made laws and traditions that they lost sight of what was good and right. Jesus showed in Mark 3:4 that the Sabbath is a day to do good. God provided the Sabbath as a day of rest but that in no way indicates a day of “laziness.” Jesus and the Bible clearly teach that the Sabbath is in no way a time of selfish indulgence, it is a day set aside for rest and worship. While God derives no benefit from our rest on the Sabbath, it gives us time to rejuvenate mentally, physically and spiritually. It also gives us a chance to spend time with God and focus on Him, studying and learning. And it is a commemorative day; similar to how the 4th of July commemorates the independence of the United States, the Sabbath commemorates our grateful acknowledgment that God was our Creator. We lay aside our own pursuits and interests for only one day of the seven. “If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the Sabbath a delight and the Lord’s holy day honorable, and if you honor it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words, then you will find your joy in the Lord,” (Isaiah 58:13). By trying to focus too hard on the words of the rule the Pharisees missed its intent. Many of them were so caught up in their man-made laws and traditions that they lost sight of what was good and right. Jesus showed in Mark 3:4Open Link in New Window that the Sabbath is a day to do good. God provided the Sabbath as a day of rest but that in no way indicates a day of “laziness.” Jesus and the Bible clearly teach that the Sabbath is in no way a time of selfish indulgence, it is a day set aside for rest and worship. While God derives no benefit from our rest on the Sabbath, it gives us time to rejuvenate mentally, physically and spiritually. It also gives us a chance to spend time with God and focus on Him, studying and learning. And it is a commemorative day; similar to how the 4th of July commemorates the independence of the United States, the Sabbath commemorates our grateful acknowledgment that God was our Creator. We lay aside our own pursuits and interests for only one day of the seven. “If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the Sabbath a delight and the Lord’s holy day honorable, and if you honor it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words, then you will find your joy in the Lord,” (Isaiah 58:13Open Link in New Window).

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5892 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:49:13 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5892 Citing examples of people who misunderstood the Fourth Commandment does not show the Commandment itself as flawed, only that those people were incorrect in their understanding. Ironically, the story mentioned in Mark 2:23-27 is not evidence of a flawed Commandment but shows Jesus teaching and upholding it. Crops are not to be harvested on the Sabbath (Exodus 34:21), but Jesus and the disciples were not “harvesting corn on the Sabbath,” they merely picked something to eat; picking food for a meal is far from harvesting. Back in those days farmers would leave the edges of their fields unharvested so some of their crops could be picked by travelers or the poor and needy (Leviticus 19:9 and Deuteronomy 23:25). The Pharisees, who were eager to find fault in Jesus, tried to pass judgment. However, Jesus and the disciples clearly were not harvesting the grain for personal gain, but quite simply looking for something to eat. Citing examples of people who misunderstood the Fourth Commandment does not show the Commandment itself as flawed, only that those people were incorrect in their understanding. Ironically, the story mentioned in Mark 2:23-27Open Link in New Window is not evidence of a flawed Commandment but shows Jesus teaching and upholding it. Crops are not to be harvested on the Sabbath (Exodus 34:21Open Link in New Window), but Jesus and the disciples were not “harvesting corn on the Sabbath,” they merely picked something to eat; picking food for a meal is far from harvesting. Back in those days farmers would leave the edges of their fields unharvested so some of their crops could be picked by travelers or the poor and needy (Leviticus 19:9Open Link in New Window and Deuteronomy 23:25Open Link in New Window). The Pharisees, who were eager to find fault in Jesus, tried to pass judgment. However, Jesus and the disciples clearly were not harvesting the grain for personal gain, but quite simply looking for something to eat.

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5891 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:48:33 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5891 The quote from Cinema Paradiso is another example of blaming one who is not at fault. God did not create our world to exist the way it does. He created it to be perfect but our sin has made it the way it is today. Soon He will return it to it’s perfect state, I only hope I can be there to see it. The quote from Cinema Paradiso is another example of blaming one who is not at fault. God did not create our world to exist the way it does. He created it to be perfect but our sin has made it the way it is today. Soon He will return it to it’s perfect state, I only hope I can be there to see it.

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5890 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:48:08 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5890 The people building the tower of Babel were not confused through a difference in language to prevent them from “exercising god-like powers.” Being a short time after the flood, some people thought they could build a grand tower that would reach so high, if a worldwide flood were to happen again, they would be “high and dry” so to speak. The people building the tower of Babel were not confused through a difference in language to prevent them from “exercising god-like powers.” Being a short time after the flood, some people thought they could build a grand tower that would reach so high, if a worldwide flood were to happen again, they would be “high and dry” so to speak.

]]> By: Ray_Light http://www.anatheist.net/2009/01/bible-based-morality-the-fourth-commandment/comment-page-1/#comment-5889 Ray_Light Wed, 20 May 2009 17:47:43 +0000 http://www.anatheist.net/?p=1330#comment-5889 Adam and Eve were not kicked out of Eden for acquiring a “god-like ability” and on the verge of acquiring “god-like immortality.” They had to leave Eden because they chose to sin, the forfeited their right to be there (of their own free will). Had they been allowed to stay and eat from the tree of life sin would be eternal. After learning many of a vast array of atrocities that have resulted from the pervasive sins in this world, the fact that we are all going to die seems like a much better alternative than suffering from eternal evil. Adam and Eve were not kicked out of Eden for acquiring a “god-like ability” and on the verge of acquiring “god-like immortality.” They had to leave Eden because they chose to sin, the forfeited their right to be there (of their own free will). Had they been allowed to stay and eat from the tree of life sin would be eternal. After learning many of a vast array of atrocities that have resulted from the pervasive sins in this world, the fact that we are all going to die seems like a much better alternative than suffering from eternal evil.

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