Comments on: Paul vs. Jesus on Salvation

By: James Tracy

James Tracy — Sun, 14 Feb 2010 04:46:09 +0000

Good for you. I presume, then, that you somehow missed stuff like this:

"there came out a fire from the Lord, and consumed the 250 men that offered incense" (Num. 16:35 ). "the Lord sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died" (Num. 21:6 ). "See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound and I heal…." (Deut. 32:39 ). "The Lord smote the men of Beth-shemesh, because they had looked into the ark of the Lord, even he smote of the people 50,070 men: and the people lamented, because the Lord had smitten many of the people with a great slaughter" (1 Sam. 6:19 ). "The Lord kills, and makes alive: he brings down to the grave, and brings up" (1 Sam. 2:6 ). "the hand of the Lord was heavy upon them of Ashdod, and he destroyed them, and smote them…." (1 Sam. 5:6 ). "it came to pass about 10 days after, that the Lord smote Nabal, that he died" (1 Sam. 25:38 ). "Who smote great nations and slew mighty kings…." (Psalms 135:10 ). "For by fire and by his sword will the Lord plead with all flesh: and the slain of the Lord shall be many" (Isaiah 66:16 ). "I will dash them one against another, even the father and the sons together, saith the Lord: I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy them" (Jer. 13:14 ). "I have sent among you the pestilence after the manner of Egypt: your young men have I slain with the sword…." (Amos 4:10 ). "For our God is a consuming fire" (Heb. 12:29 ). Also note: Gen. 38:7,10 , Ex. 22:23-24 , Num. 11:1 , Deut. 32:41-42 , Joshua 10:10-11, 1 Sam. 5:9 , Psalms 136:17-18 , Hosea 9:16 , Amos 2:3 , Ex. 4:24, 2 Sam. 6:6-7 , and 2 Kings 5:7 .

"ye shall chase your enemies, and they shall fall before you by the sword. And five of you shall chase a hundred, and a hundred of you shall put 10,000 to flight: and your enemies shall fall before you by the sword" (Lev. 26:7-8 ). "the Lord said to Moses, Take all the heads of the people, and hang them up before the Lord against the sun, that the fierce anger of the Lord may be turned away from Israel. And Moses said to the judges of Israel. Slay every one his men that were joined to Baal" (Num. 25:4-5 ). "Vex the Midianites and smite them" (Num. 25:17 ). "But of the cities of these people, which the Lord thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breathes. But thou shalt utterly destroy them…as the Lord thy God has commanded thee" (Deut. 20:16-17 ). "So Joshua smote all the country of the hills…he left none remaining, but utterly destroyed all that breathed, as the Lord God of Israel commanded" (Joshua 10:40 ). "As I listened, god said to the others, 'Follow him through the city and kill, without showing pity or compassion. Slaughter old men, young men and maidens, women and children…." (Ezek. 9:5-6). "And the Lord sent you on a mission, saying 'Go and completely destroy those wicked people, the Amalekites; make war on them until you have wiped them out.'" (1 Sam. 15:18 ). "Attack the land of Merathaim and those who live in Pekod. Pursue, kill and completely destroy them' declares the Lord. Do everything I have commanded you" (Jer. 50:21 ). "Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys" (1 Sam. 15:3 ). Also note: Ex. 32:27-28 , Num. 21:34-35, 31 :7-8, 35:19-21, and Jer. 48:10 .

By: Thomas

Thomas — Sat, 13 Feb 2010 15:56:44 +0000

Why yes I have and I'm glad you asked……
Psalm 118:1 Give thanks to the LORD, who is good, whose love endures forever.
Psalm 136:1 Praise the LORD, who is so good; God's love endures forever;
Psalm 57:10 For great is your love, reaching to the heavens;your faithfulness reaches to the skies.
Psalm 136 Oh, give thanks to the LORD, for He is good!
For His mercy endures forever.
2 Oh, give thanks to the God of gods!
For His mercy endures forever.
3 Oh, give thanks to the Lord of lords!
For His mercy endures forever:
The OT has much to say about the love of God . Look at how God saved the Jews from being totally destroyed by Pharaoh in Egypt. There has been much hatred toward Jews though out time and God had saved them from their enemies. You can even see it today.
God will always saves those who believe in Him from those who want to destroy .

By: James Tracy

James Tracy — Thu, 11 Feb 2010 16:28:42 +0000

Have you read the Old Testament lately?

By: Thomas

Thomas — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 21:31:55 +0000

What is the reason the Bible is consistently the most read book ever? It is the most scrutinized book ever,yet it still remains popular in spite of harsh opposition.
In China, the government tries to outlaw Bibles and look what has happened there. The church is growing and there is nothing that the atheistic government of China can do to stop it. And they are trying. They are throwing pastors in jail and in labor camps with no trials or no explanation.

The Bible teaches love and love will always win over violence and hatred of the atheistic government of China.
God is Love. It will always be the better way.

By: James Tracy

James Tracy — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 03:37:26 +0000

Who said anything about lying? What were the motives of the followers of the cult of Dionysus for making up his death and resurrection? What were the motives of the admirers of Caesar Augustus for claiming that he was born of a virgin? All religions face various amounts of persecution. Does that make them all true? Joseph Smith was persecuted and his Mormon followers were chased all the way to Utah. Why didn't his disciples come out and tell the truth? Besides, how would we know if any early followers of Jesus came out and told the 'truth'? Virtually all dissenting documents from that period were destroyed. The easiest way to do away with a book in the ancient world was simply to stop copying it.

By: Thomas

Thomas — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 21:34:44 +0000

"Resurrection: It may seem like the most heinous crime against humanity ever in retrospect but you would have to fault his followers for foolishly perpetuating it, not Jesus"
What would be the motive for his followers to make up the resurrection? And since the followers of Jesus were being persecuted, killed, fed to the lions…….etc, what would they gain from it? If they deliberately lied , wouldn't at least one of the disciples come out and tell the 'truth' in order to save their own skin?
And the cults of dying godmen were a part of religions that are dying.
Christianity is far from dying away. It is growing more and more. China has right now the fastest growing churchs in the world. The medias won't report it but its true. You will see Christianity continue to grow because of the teachings of Jesus. Love will always win.
I think that even you would agree that love is the better way.

By: Silas

Silas — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 16:23:51 +0000

No, I don't know what you mean Thomas. Why do people like to use half of a bible verse in a vague manner to explain things?
New International Version (©1984)
The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love it will eat its fruit.

New Living Translation (©2007)
The tongue can bring death or life; those who love to talk will reap the consequences.

English Standard Version (©2001)
Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and those who love it will eat its fruits.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
Death and life are in the power of the tongue, And those who love it will eat its fruit.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love to talk will have to eat their own words.

King James Bible
Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

American King James Version
Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

American Standard Version
Death and life are in the power of the tongue; And they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

Bible in Basic English
Death and life are in the power of the tongue; and those to whom it is dear will have its fruit for their food.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Death and life are in the power of the tongue: they that love it, shall eat the fruits thereof.

Darby Bible Translation
Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

English Revised Version
Death and life are in the power of the tongue; and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

Webster's Bible Translation
Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit of it.

World English Bible
Death and life are in the power of the tongue; those who love it will eat its fruit.

Young's Literal Translation
Death and life are in the power of the tongue, And those loving it eat its fruit.

How can we be predestined and a choice at the same time?
God desires all to be saved, he's omnipotent, all must be saved.

Now I know there is power in belief, if I believe I can do something I will try and the chances of that coming to pass increase, but to say only believe something and it shall be is frankly not so. Before there was evidence to the contrary. Some people believed the world was flat, the sun revolved around the earth, you would die of suffocation if you traveled over 40mph. Someone on drugs believed they could fly. Many times I can recall hearing " Oh, I thought! " and it just wasn't so. I believed my cursor was going to go left, but the menu popped up instead a few times while writing this. Even though I pressed the menu button why didn't the cursor go left, I believed I was pressing left arrow.

All things are be possible, not guaranteed.

I'm jobless and broke why wouldn't I cash a million dollar check? Although you are right in a sense because after reading your post if I new you wrote the check I probably wouldn't because I don't believe you have a million dollars. Much less a million dollars you would give to me.

By: James Tracy

James Tracy — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 15:55:17 +0000

At the same time, those teachings that you attribute to Jesus were hardly original to him! Jesus was not the first to make use of the golden rule. In fact, I would love to which moral teachings, if any, were actually original to Jesus.

Resurrection: It may seem like the most heinous crime against humanity ever in retrospect but you would have to fault his followers for foolishly perpetuating it, not Jesus. Then again, cults of rising and dying godmen were prevalent in the Greek and Roman worlds of the time. Anyway – you are speaking of an enormously large IF.

By: Thomas

Thomas — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 12:16:52 +0000

The majority of people believe and agree with the teachings of Jesus. Love one another, Do unto others as you would have them do to you, Blessed are the peacemakers….etc…..Even atheists agree with most of the teachings that Jesus taught!!!!
However, for me, the deciding factor is this. IF Jesus Christ rose from the dead, then he was the most successful person to have ever lived. IF he didn't, then it is the most heinous crime against humanity ever. So I admire atheists for their stand against what they see as foolishness. They are true to their belief.
But, if Jesus did rise from the dead…….
All of Christianity stands or falls on whether Jesus Christ actually was raised from the dead or not.. There is no middle road.

By: Silas

Silas — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 09:38:35 +0000

I wish I had written this in place of the last paragraph above.

You could give me a check for a million dollars, however, it would do me no good because you don't have a million dollars.